PICANTO 2004 1-1 - vibration during acceleration

[picomaniac]

Dear friends,

I have a picanto 2004 1.1 with 315.000 km.
I bought it second hand with 270.000 before 2 years.
Up to now, I had no major issue and I have changed shocks and standard maintanance (sparks, filters, etc & timing belt - all works in official KIA network)

Since a month I have noticed a weird vibration about 3000 RPM and when accelerating the car with 3rd-4rth gear, it is shaking like the engine is shaking (not the steering wheel)
After 3600 RPM...all fine.
Also when cold...almost fine in all power band with minimum shaking.
I am suspecting either engine mounts, or drive shafts or..an unbalanced clutch set.
By the way..clutch is giving vibrations every morning when starting to move the car.

Any feedback will be mostly welcomed.

Thank You

[BAU]

The car has a lot of km. We don't know if the clutch has changed so far. We guess so. We do not know if it was installed correctly or its quality.

First of all it can be from a wrongly mounted or defective clutch, unbalanced.

Or for second , the engine mounting on the body should be checked.

The vibrations when leaving the place in the morning show that there is still something in the clutch. It may slip, it may have oil, or it may break the friction material. Or the clutch disc has defective damping springs

[picomaniac]

yes, I agree with all your good points.
But..I have done with this clutch more than 45000 km and its behavior is identical from the day I bought the car from previous owner.
So..even if something is wrong with the clutch set, still this wierd vibration during acceleration between a given RPM band has appeared lately.
Also...in neutral, no vibration at all..
When I check engine in the engine bay...even when opening the throttle, no excesssive movement at all.
So..I am afraid..perhaps it is the drive axles...from the inner joints next to the gearbox.
Anyone had them replaced?
I am taking the car..to the official KIA garage early morning before my work just for a test drive and an expert opinion.
I'll revert to update,

Thank you for your concern and the time spent on my problem.

[BAU]

This is true . If you are in doubt that the clutch may be to blame, and the vibration may only occur at a certain speed and in the movement of the car, there may be an imbalance in the fly-wheel or clutch and possibly a defect in the gearbox. Maybe a bearing.
Let us know what you heard from the mechanics.

Good-luck

[picomaniac]

Finally, KIA garage claimed..that I need to replace both boots...(inner CV joints).
They asked...a crazy amount of money..and I am planning to do the job myself.
If all goes well..I'll revert to update..with the final outcome.
I only wish they are..right becuase I already ordered after market inner joints :
each kit contains Boot, cross, special grease, rubber cap, special clamps.
job seems...not too difficult..I'll try myself.
My only worry..is if possible to avoid removing the whole drive shaft as I don't want to mess with the huge nut in the hub.
I was thinking of releasing the shock from the hub and trying somehow to make room to remove the boot from the gearbox and fix the new cv while I am under the car.
Has anybody performed such repair by himself?

[BAU]

If up to this number of km these articulations (planetary shaft heads from the wheel) have not been changed, they should be changed anyway.
Even if you later realize that the noise may come from elsewhere
Wear in most cases occurs at the wheel joint and not at the gearbox.
If you like mechanics, it's not too difficult to change them yourself.
But unfortunately you will have to untie that big nut from the wheel hub. To remove the planetary from the spindle.
But you will have to unscrew the planetary from the car and work on a workbench with a vise.
You should best search on google and youtube and find a movie about what to do
Then tell us if you managed to finish the intervention well

[picomaniac]

Hello my good friends,

I just bought the stuff.
I bought 2 full sets x Inner CV joins with Grease, "Cross", rubbet cover, special clamps which can be installed with only a simple set of plyers.
I open them and checked: they have zero tolerance.
Then I went under car cause I changed oil and oil filter and given the opportunity I checked the CV.
Indeed..the left..has quite a lot of tolerance..so definetely there is wear in that one.
Didn't bother to check the other..but I an pretty sure..it will also have some tolerance when moving it my hand.
I also bought 2 rubber sets to change the other joint once I'll have the whole drive shaft on my workbench.
I also managed to find 2 new central hub nuts.
My worry is that my torque wrench goes up to 120 NM and as I found from manual (I managed to download engine manual in russian & english from our good forum even though some links are not active anymore) I need to go to 200 NM if I remember correct.
I have found a formula..to step down the NM..by increasing the lenght of the torque wrench but I must find a work arround with the needed joint between the torque wrench and the other wrench I'll use in combination.

My other worry..is if I can undo easily the one screw that hold the lower joint to remove the hub from the lower joint and get room to remove the drive shaft without having to set apart the tie rods cause I dont want to remove them. I changed during the summer and they have castle nut...but the usual "safety" nut.
So..better not to mess with them again, worst comes worst I'll remove the other 2 bolts..to separate the Mc Pherson from the hub.

Can anybody give me the diagram of the manual transmision...cause..I am not sure..I can find the 2 screw for draining & leveling up.
I already bought the 2 needed washers...from KIA, one has larger inner diammeter but both seem to have save outer diameter so I guess one screw is thicker.

Another..wierd..thing: i tried to change...cabin filter..but..guess what:
My car..has no cabin filter. My module is different from the DIYs in the internet. I have no opening above..the motor...to remove and access the filter.
In fact..I removed..the plastic cover beaneath the front windscreen and I can see..with my own eyes...the fan!
So no filter..to change...so..even less spares needed...

I would appreciate a drawing showing how can I change manual transmission oil in my car.


Thank You in advance for your help and comments!

[picomaniac]

Sorry I mean..my tie rod..has no castle nut & safety pin...only a safety nut with the plastic material in the front threds.
Also I don't want to mess my wheel alignment.

[Caralumba]

Does this help you in any way?

https://partsouq.com/en/catalog/genuine ... 4594302405

[picomaniac]

Thank you!

Unfortunately I have the manual 5-Speed Gearbox.
is there any chance to find the service manual?

[Caralumba]

It's hard to find the service manual.....sorry.
https://partsouq.com/en/catalog/genuine ... 8&cid=2&q=

[picomaniac]

this link is quite helpful.
I am planning to try to overhaul the CV joints this coming weekend..provided the weather does allow me to work.
I have no garage..so I have to do the job outdoors, in the open.

Let's see..how it will go.
Thank you my friend for your help & support and the time devoted to me.

being greatly indebted.
I'll revert to inform you how things went once I have some news (good or bad).

[picomaniac]

The job was succesfully done!
It was a pane...without impact gun to remove hub nuts...let alone to torque them up to 240ΝΜ but..after trying various tricks I did it.
The left side CV was a real mess. Somebody had "overhauled it" and..the one of the three wheels was missing inner cylindrical bearing items so the one wheel was...a mess and essentially the joint was depending on the remaining 2 wheels.
The right side..was a better but with some wear allowing also movement.

I put new gear oil FUCHS 75W-85 full synthetic.
The gearbox is.switching gears like a charm and the car goes nicely and smoothly with no vibration at all.

For someone having the right tools and the ability to work under the work in a decent manner (I was struggling as my jack is small and for safety I put some bricks so no much room to work under the car) job could take no more than 1-2 hours with a break for coffee.
For..me..it was a nightmare...took me almost 6 hours...as I was stopping to get..tools and trying to remove the safety clip from CV joint which was not the easy one with the two tiny holes to open it easily.

[Caralumba]

Great job Pico, we're glad to hear that .....you did it again.
Congrats.

[BAU]

Congratulations on what you have accomplished.

For this type of small car, for this engine and for its age, we would like to hear that you have solved the problems and you are satisfied with it.

Let's hope that the defect was just from here and all will be good from now.

Congratulations also for the courage to start these repairs yourself